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April 29, 2010

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adamcrazypants

rad.

I want to write that jury nullification book.

marriotr

Who wrote "trial by jury"? your description makes it appealing! I assume it's not the gilbert and sullivan play.

quietdown

Yinz follow the Peter Watts case any?

http://pittsburghalphatoomega.com/peter-watts-not-guilty-of-assault-guilty-of-perfectly-reasonable-query/

Watts defended the jury on his blog - which made sense as he'd yet to be sentenced - but every article I read on the case (that allowed comments) had at least one commenter bring up nullification & chide the ignorant jury, which was real encouraging.

Adam, write that shit!

Crispy, wish you'd taught at Pitt when I went there - your students don't know how lucky they are.

Thomas J. Bieter

Here is Professor Butler on the 60 Minutes TV program. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8eQ_EYwQQI

As a young prosecutor, I prosecuted a case that involved some jury nullification. Four alcoholics (two Native Americans, and two guys of Finnish ancestry) had a party which ended in violence. The Finnish guys beat the Indians so severely that they suffered permanent injuries and almost died. They were charged with Aggravated Assault. The jury convicted the Finnish guys of Misdemeanor assault.

Because I thought that the case was a slam dunk, after the verdict, I asked "What Happened?" I was bluntly informed that the public defender knew that "no jury would ever convict a couple of drunken finlanders of beating up a couple of fuckin Indians."

Did the Indians get justice?

I would argue that Finlander bias (jury nullification) trumpted the proportionality aspect of justice (a conviction for the crime of felony Agg. Assault which is proportionate to the harm visited on the victims)

The trial took place in Duluth, Minnesota, where there are a lot of people of Finnish ancestry.

To Professor Butler, I say what limits, if any, are there to jury nullification?

marriotr

Great counterpoint, Thomas! Man...jury systems...I am still trying to understand how justification structures work for ANY justice system. Nullification plays a role in justifying ours, but it's so...uneven...Augh. I have a headache. I need to go read another book.

CF Oxtrot

Jury nullification exists already. It's just not called that.

Andrew Dobbs

Bieter makes a good point. For every nullification of the Zenger type there are 2 all white juries from the Jim Crow era that acquitted clearly culpable Klansmen for lynching some uppity brother. That being said, this is absolutely one of those baby and bathwater situations, and I am a big believer in jury nullification.

I think we must also remember that prison reform movements are vital to the proper functioning of the carceral system. Foucault points this out in Discipline and Punish: prison reform is as old as the prison, and fewer prisoners won't mean an end to the prison industrial complex, only no prisoners will.

And that *might* be the perfect Hip Hop jam. I remember hearing it for the first time and just playing it over and over and over again. I'm increasingly convinced that East Coast is the best (don't tell any other Texans or Southerners that I said this). I love my H-Town stuff, but still...

c.t.mummey

marriotr:

lysander spooner wrote it. follow the link.

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